Author Topic: listmailpro.com quick fix - template?  (Read 4131 times)

DW

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« on: April 14, 2005, 11:52:00 am »
Hi Everyone,

I was just getting started on part 2 of the listmailpro.com website because with the new price I need a new professional image.  Some of what my members have told me is sinking in - they recommended more content, a more professional image, better listing of features, better demo process, etc.

While struggling as usual with Photoshop (I'm not all that great with it or design in general) a friend of mine mentioned he bought a template for $6 and his site looks great.  He made a good point that design should be left to those who are good at it, leaving the technical stuff for us coders - then he pointed me to templatemonster.com.

After seeing some of the very stylish professional designs I'm almost sold.   I feel that a template would be the fastest way for me to gain a professional image and would allow me to work on what I need to, which is site content, demonstration, marketing and ListMail development.

While these templates are not unique (up to 5 people have purchased/downloaded most of them), they are owned (and copyrightable) once purchased.  A very professional non-unique template will cost no more than $60.  Eventually, when I'm making enough, I will be able to spring $1000-$2000 for a professional custom site.

Well, I've been shopping around and have come up with a number of designs I think might work for ListMail.  It would take me months to design a site like any of these - if I could even do it at all.  As I said, I'm more of a technical programmer than a designer.  I can, of course, modify a template to my liking / use.  What do _you_ think about leaving it to the pros?  Is non-unique (5-10 copies out of billions of sites...)  a major no-no?

I'm not really interested in a flash site.  I like professional HTML with images.  Here are my best picks so far.

http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/851.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/5276.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/2984.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/208.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/7871.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/3590.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/8016.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/7987.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/7962.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/7938.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/7907.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/7775.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/7762.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/7716.html
http://www.templatemonster.com/website-templates/3991.html

As you can see I'm still narrowing it down. :)

Thanks for any suggestions!

Regards
Dean Wiebe
ListMailPRO Author & Developer - Help | Support | Hosting

steve

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2005, 12:26:55 pm »
In general, I'd stay away from the flash versions too. I do not think it is needed. Maybe for a banner it would be okay.

Keep in mind that you want to be able to "tie-in" the look and feel of other sections of your site, including the forums and the help pages. It's now pretty darn expensive, but a few years ago I used RoboHelp to design some Web help pages for a company intranet and it was cool.

Keep in mind that these opinions are "quick look" opinions. I take a glance at a sites design and check if it catches my eye within about two seconds. You need to consider what you want to present on the home page.

Your sites content determines the home page design - that's the way I look at it. If your company has three different divisions with 12 products, that home page/site  would require a totally different design then one with one product or service.

I've looked at templates too - download the one you like and try it. Often, you make changes to text on a page by entering text in a .txt file that is uploaded and the template pulls the text. For changes in the future - specifically changes to the templates - requires some knowlege of HOW the template/site was put together. Sometimes the designs were a bit beyond where I wanted to go.

851 - looks okay
5276 - too busy
2984 - sort of busy
208 - like this one
7871 - pretty good
3590 - looks okay
8016 - busy
7987 - ok
7962 - pretty good
7938 - busy
7907 - busy
7775 - busy busy
7762 - sort of okay
7716 - sort of okay
3991 - nah

Steve

jonisolis

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Dean, stick with your site and just redo your header graphic
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2005, 07:51:12 am »
Dear Dean,

My option is just have someone redo your header graphic. I don't think you need a whole site redo but if you do I wouldn't go with this company (check out some ebook designers; their prices are better and you get original art that no one else will have).

People coming to your website are going to be focused on what is in it for them. Spend most your money on sales copy help. Better listing of BENEFITS NOT features is the main thing that I see that is needed. How does each feature benefit the user? In the Demo explain how each thing works and how that can help someone make their business a better success. Ask peopple that have bought ListMail Pro how they use it to help their business.

Spend the most time and money on the main item what will generate additional sales -- your sales copy.
 

ebook designers...(there are many more out there)

http://www.killercovers.com/
or
http://www.maxcovers.com/

Other pointers:

* NO FLASH on home page
* Keep site clean and uncluttered of unnecessary graphics
* benefits benefits benefits -- you can never go wrong listing theses

I wish you the best of luck!

mr.trevor

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2005, 08:55:07 am »
Hi Dean,
Well, I am sort of sorry that you are going for a new look, I quite like the current one.

I would agree in the main with jonisolis, but the header looks fine me.

I have given more of my opinion in a couple of previous post to the forum, so I will keep this brief (is that possible..)

Look at what you are competing with and what people are looking for.
Show all of the FUNCTIONS and BENEFITS.

It’s a mailing system. Show what it can mail, how it can mail.

Will it have the facilities to do what is wanted? Can it be adapted to all the different types of mailing jobs? How easy is it to install or get installed. How easy is it to set up. How much time will it take to use?

How automatic are the functions, how simple are they to use.

It’s not a games program site for the kids.
It should be informative and functional.
It doesn’t need to be flashy.

Don’t show me how good you are at web-design or how nice the templates are… WILL IT DO WHAT I WANT?

Show off what it can do – all what it can do – not leave out some things (I wondered about that xtra folder).

95% seems OK to me… just a few revisions and additions needed.
Will it do this for me? Will it do that? A Q&A list from the main page would go a long way and save potential customers (and you) a lot of time.

Ohh dear… and this is the short version.
TrevorW

DW

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2005, 10:06:26 am »
Thank you all for your excellent input.  After tossing around the idea and looking at dozens of templates I am beginning to see that a template will not solve even half of my problems.  Sure, it might look nice (well, I liked one or two), but if the content and program don't cut it the sale won't be made.

I should think about what my clients will find useful and informative and, I agree, I should describe, explain, and demonstrate the benefits of ListMail more thoroughly - before I completely change the site design.

I can do very simple web design and I can put in all the content.  The only thing I can't do (well) is graphics - but I might work on that, too. :)  (It's not so hard to make a font look sharp and glow a little).  I just need to plan and act on my own ideas and all of the excellent input I have received.

Thank you again for your input!  I am listening.  I will (most likely) be working with my current design for the time being. :D

Regards
Dean Wiebe
ListMailPRO Author & Developer - Help | Support | Hosting

mr.trevor

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2005, 10:57:32 am »
Dean… can I add a controversial viewpoint to your thoughts.
Your product website is used to compare your product to your competitors product/s. You need to cover all the points that they mention.

Take a look at the three (for example) that I have mentioned in previous posts.
They were what I was comparing before I purchased ListMail.

I would think that Add2it is your biggest rival. The marketing is more intense. They follow up visitors with their newsletters regularly. (You really should get ListMail for yourself.!) They have competitions (to win software prizes – first prize some freebie download with a $25 off any future script purchase..!). They actually have lots going on, here it is only for owners. You need contact with prospective owners as well.

All the (advertised ? ) benefits of owning ListMail to keep in touch to promote sales you don’t do. I have had a whole variety of offers and promotions from these people and through other means.

Go take a look (and subscribe) get some inside information. Don’t use a banner like theirs.! Their site is poor but the content and follow-up is good.
TrevorW

DW

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2005, 12:04:10 pm »
I have not focused enough on marketing.  In fact, I have been rather ignorant.  I need to maximize my conversion from browsers to buyers.  Now that I've raised the price sales have decreased but I'm making about the same amount of money.  It's time to improve the site and my marketing tactics and explore the full potential of ListMail.

I am drafting my demo newsletter and outlining the new site changes - I am excited to get it out there. :D

Thanks again for the excellent input!
Dean Wiebe
ListMailPRO Author & Developer - Help | Support | Hosting

mcnak

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2005, 08:01:36 pm »
Dean, if you decide to use templates get them on Ebay. You can get 25,000+ templates that are just as good if not better than template monsters and for only $10!!! Here are some examples.......

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=80342&item=7149470202&rd=1

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=80342&item=7150369610&rd=1

Also if you are not a photoshop or dreamweaver pro then designing any template can be a task.  

Best regards,
Matt

BGSWebDesign

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2005, 07:36:55 am »
Hi DW,

Ok, here's my opinion: 7871, or 208 are best templates - BUT - you do NOT really need one, why???

As others have mentioned, Graphics is NOT going to help you sell, what you need is better interaction with your prospects, better Screen Snapshots of LMP - and all of it's features - WHY LMP is better than any other mailer...  

Look at this quote from above:
Quote
I would think that Add2it is your biggest rival. The marketing is more intense. They follow up visitors with their newsletters regularly. (You really should get ListMail for yourself.!) They have competitions (to win software prizes – first prize some freebie download with a $25 off any future script purchase..!). They actually have lots going on,


I believe that's exactly right, you need LMP for yourself - USE it in your own newsletter - offer promotions - MAYBE even make a Promotion ADD-ON that sends out promotions to prospects - see where this is going, you could write all kinds of little add-ons: give them away for free as a way to entice buyers - for example, buy now and get the Promotion Add-On for Free, also write a few others that people have asked for most - for example Custom Delete's, Move from one list to another, Auto read or download of entire Sequence of follow-ups, the list goes on and on, but I don't feel you're taking advantage of this, instead you're giving away free support to many who whine that they can't get their Bounce Handling to work!  Instead, make these people pay for support - OR - better yet, OFFER downloadable FULLY detailed eBooks that documents what YOU DID to fix these problems on others websites - that way anyone can get their hand on these fixes at anytime - or sell them for $5-$10 each, people who want the info NOW can get it, and they'll have their fix and that's one less person taking time away from you and your work making LMP better - got it?

Ok, that's all my two cents again, here's a recap (in order of importance):
1.) No template needed - rework your Header Graphic or LMP Logo (it looks a little amateurish).
2.) Show Screen Shots on your home page, or link to them
3.) Point out why LMP is better than others, give EXACT details of features and how much it will save the user - ie - NO Tech background needed, etc... (throw that into the eBooks as described above).
4.) Get LMP and use it yourself - highlight how it works by sending out a regular newsletter - promote your product to Prospects - Offer them free Add-Ons or Ebooks if they purchase now... follow-up regularly....
5.) Lastly, make these Add-Ons, or Ebooks available to dedicated Users too - or give them away as promotion for Naming the next Add-On, etc...

One final thing too - if you really want to learn Internet Marketing I highly recommend this video 9 DVD course from Corey Rudl - I've followed his work for years, he's a multi-millionaire internet marketer from Canada  who knows what he's doing - I'll be purchasing this course myself, and I bought his original Internet Marketing Tips course way back in 1997!  Here's the link:
http://www.marketingtips.com/wealthvideos/t/3576

That's it... take the ideas and use them - don't worry about re-doing your entire website (where did this come from???).

Good luck,
Thanks,
-Brett
http://www.bgswebdesign.com/Contact-Us.php

*** I do custom List Mail Pro installations ***
Contact me through my website (above)

mr.trevor

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2005, 09:59:28 am »
Brilliant webshaman. 100%.
It's what we have all been telling DW in a nutshell.
Copy your competitors and then best them.
Best FREE help, look at what your competitors are doing.
TrevorW

DW

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« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2005, 01:26:04 pm »
Looking at all those templates gave me ideas on what to do with content.  I'm in the midst of designing a much cleaner, simpler, content-driven web site.  Check it out: http://lmhost2.com

This is a very preliminary copy of the site - I've only been working on it for a few hours (mostly on initial design while I practiced in PhotoShop).

The logo will most likely be changed;  more font colour(s) :shock: may be used;  I will add some more sidebars (news, testimonies, partners, etc); I might add a search (site/forum/help) feature in the top right corner there; I will probably try my hand at putting in some nice-looking background images in certain areas; and I will be improving the pre-sales information and experience considerably.

Thanks a lot for the wake-up call, guys.  I feel a lot better doing it myself and am finding it's not as hard as it once seemed.

Onward, forward - after this it will be time for some more ListMail features and improvements. :D

Hey, if any of you photoshop gurus want to make a logo for me I'd be forever in your debt!  If not, I'll probably install a few thousands photoshop plugins and see what I can do about making something 'original'. :)

Regards
Dean Wiebe
ListMailPRO Author & Developer - Help | Support | Hosting

mr.trevor

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2005, 01:35:40 pm »
Fine start.
Maybe you should had done the 'Buy Now' first... ;-)

edit:
Just a thought about what webshaman said before... of course giving addons to current owners is probably what you would do anyway, but giving them away - generously - to site visitors and downloadable from a newsletter would be a growing incentive to buy.
Who would buy a different product when you have been given so many addons in advance for this one.
Let's hope you don't get too good at this marketing or I might be talked into buying another copy...
TrevorW

BGSWebDesign

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listmailpro.com quick fix - template?
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2005, 12:13:17 pm »
Hi All,

One quick followup, I received this course today (it's amazing, powerful and very valuable) and I got an email from Corey that this is only going to be offered for a very limited time, so, I suggest if anyone is interested in getting the most from their website with Internet Marketing consider this course at:
http://www.marketingtips.com/wealthvideos/t/3576

That's it for now, I'm glad you'll consider adding new and interesting 'add-ons' to LMP Dean, I'm sure it will help, thanks again for a great update to version 1.8.
Thanks,
-Brett
http://www.bgswebdesign.com/Contact-Us.php

*** I do custom List Mail Pro installations ***
Contact me through my website (above)